Behringer V-VERB2496
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Anonyme
1531
Sujet de la discussion Posté le 06/04/2004 à 17:43:25Behringer V-VERB2496
Bonjour,
J'aurais voulu connaître les qualités de cette nouvelle réverbe de Behringer.
D'après les infos que l'on peut obtenir sur leur site, cette réverbe serait de grande qualité :
"Le V-VERB PRO REV2496 est un processeur à modélisation de réverbérations de très grande classe [u]simulant certains des processeurs spécialisés référentiels les plus célèbres
. Il tire sa puissance de deux processeurs d'effets indépendants accessibles à partir de ses connecteurs analogiques et numériques. Il possède également huit superbes algorithmes de réverbération modélisés à partir des meilleurs processeurs de reverb du monde, mais également des effets de modulation allant du X-over Delay au Chorus/Flanger ainsi qu'un compresseur stéréo. Ses superbes convertisseurs A/N et N/A 24 bits/96 kHz et le fonctionnement en 96 kHz de ses deux processeurs (autrement dit pour chacun des 4 canaux !) garantissent des performances exceptionnelles."
J'aurais voulu savoir si quelqu'un l'aurait déjà essayé et si vous pensez que ce prouduit peut vraiment prétendre ses qualités annoncées (simulant certains des processeurs spécialisés référentiels les plus célèbres).
Merci
J'aurais voulu connaître les qualités de cette nouvelle réverbe de Behringer.
D'après les infos que l'on peut obtenir sur leur site, cette réverbe serait de grande qualité :
"Le V-VERB PRO REV2496 est un processeur à modélisation de réverbérations de très grande classe [u]simulant certains des processeurs spécialisés référentiels les plus célèbres
. Il tire sa puissance de deux processeurs d'effets indépendants accessibles à partir de ses connecteurs analogiques et numériques. Il possède également huit superbes algorithmes de réverbération modélisés à partir des meilleurs processeurs de reverb du monde, mais également des effets de modulation allant du X-over Delay au Chorus/Flanger ainsi qu'un compresseur stéréo. Ses superbes convertisseurs A/N et N/A 24 bits/96 kHz et le fonctionnement en 96 kHz de ses deux processeurs (autrement dit pour chacun des 4 canaux !) garantissent des performances exceptionnelles."J'aurais voulu savoir si quelqu'un l'aurait déjà essayé et si vous pensez que ce prouduit peut vraiment prétendre ses qualités annoncées (simulant certains des processeurs spécialisés référentiels les plus célèbres).
Merci
Raoul
194
Posteur·euse AFfiné·e
Membre depuis 22 ans
44 Posté le 04/08/2004 à 08:02:43
Bonpjour,
je partage aussi les interrogation de Nico, il y a un essai sur le dernier Sound On Sound, l'essai conclu en autres que la V verb tient la comparaison avec les milieus de gammes ( sous entendu 550 et M one) mais reste en retrait rapport ai PCM 91 et autres HG.
De toutes façons les éditeurs ne se prononceraient jamais en defaveur de leurs annonceurs tels que lexicon. Il faut donc essayer et comparer!.
je partage aussi les interrogation de Nico, il y a un essai sur le dernier Sound On Sound, l'essai conclu en autres que la V verb tient la comparaison avec les milieus de gammes ( sous entendu 550 et M one) mais reste en retrait rapport ai PCM 91 et autres HG.
De toutes façons les éditeurs ne se prononceraient jamais en defaveur de leurs annonceurs tels que lexicon. Il faut donc essayer et comparer!.
Anonyme
521410
45 Posté le 04/08/2004 à 09:18:55
Oh a mon avis sos, ça doit pas leur faire peur de taper sur lexicon. moi j'avais lu des reviews des cartes sons lexicons qui sans etre cassant, n'avait rien d'elogieux...
et pour behr, je vais reprendre l'exemple de mon vamp, qui coutait la moitié d'un pod2, un tiers/quart d'un pod xt, et qui sur certains sons fait du boulot qui en bluffe plus d'un (il est un peu en retrait sur les crunchs cependant), en tout cas qui ne justifierais jamais que je mette le double du prix. ok behringer recupere les miettes, n'investis pas en r&d, et sort des "copies" mais comme c'est pas cher...
et pour behr, je vais reprendre l'exemple de mon vamp, qui coutait la moitié d'un pod2, un tiers/quart d'un pod xt, et qui sur certains sons fait du boulot qui en bluffe plus d'un (il est un peu en retrait sur les crunchs cependant), en tout cas qui ne justifierais jamais que je mette le double du prix. ok behringer recupere les miettes, n'investis pas en r&d, et sort des "copies" mais comme c'est pas cher...
Raoul
194
Posteur·euse AFfiné·e
Membre depuis 22 ans
46 Posté le 05/08/2004 à 09:01:51
Review ds Harmony Central!
Ease of Use: 9
It's not too difficult to learn. There are two effects engines, you can run any two algorithms at once in any order. There are 8 reverb algorithms, although technically only 4 distinct algorithms as 4 others are based on the main 4:
1. V-Verb (which the manual says is the most complex of the algorithms)
2. Concert Hall, Cathedral, Theater (based on the same algorithm)
3. Gold Plate
4. Ambience, Gated Reverb, Reverse Reverb
In addition to reverb there are 6 other algorithms: Delay, XOver Delay, Chorus/Flanger, Phaser, Tremolo, Compressor.
There are 4 knobs for editing patches that also double as buttons. Also, there are additional buttons to page through the parameter menus. A tap is included.
It's easy to edit presets, however, it should be easier to turn off an engine other than editing the patch. And it isn't consistent with regards to the dry/wet mix throughout the algorithms. For the reverb, there is no "mix" control, rather a combination of "dry" signal and "fx lvl" adjustments are needed when I would prefer a simple mix control like the other algorithms have.
When experimenting with thick sounds, it can be easy to overload things and have clipping occur, but it's easy to adjust the gain levels to fix the problem when it happens.
There are 10 routing options for the two engines but you can subtract 6 of those if you do not plan on using a combination of digital AND analog inputs/outputs, as most probably don't. But it is a nice feature to be able to utilize all of the inputs if you want.
I take issue with page 22 of the manual. I quote- "Thanks to its exhaustive set of digital connections, the REV2496 is almost predestined for use in a complete digital setup." A little unfounded arrogance as I am currently in the process of ordering a converter so I can connect the V-Verb's optical to my mixer's coaxial. The REV2496 has optical and AES/EBU only.
24 bit 96k, and uses 32 bit internal processing.
Sound Quality: 10
The reverb is excellent. Sounds great!! Completely smooth tails. I previously owned an MPX-1 and the reverb on this blows it away. Every one of the reverb algorithims are fantastic. I am truly amazed this thing only cost $250 and with 24/96!
Delay: Only one second of delay time. You can have up to three delays at once. Delays sound very good.
Chorus/Flanger: Not bad, nothing to write home about. I've heard worse.
Phaser: Same.
Tremolo: Fine tremolo effect.
Compressor: Haven't tried it yet...
Reliability: N/A
The knobs don't seem like the sturdiest knobs in the world, but for its low price I can't complain.
Customer Support: N/A
No clue.
Overall Rating: 10
Best reverb for the price I am guessing and with 24/96, it's an especially great deal.
Ease of Use: 9
It's not too difficult to learn. There are two effects engines, you can run any two algorithms at once in any order. There are 8 reverb algorithms, although technically only 4 distinct algorithms as 4 others are based on the main 4:
1. V-Verb (which the manual says is the most complex of the algorithms)
2. Concert Hall, Cathedral, Theater (based on the same algorithm)
3. Gold Plate
4. Ambience, Gated Reverb, Reverse Reverb
In addition to reverb there are 6 other algorithms: Delay, XOver Delay, Chorus/Flanger, Phaser, Tremolo, Compressor.
There are 4 knobs for editing patches that also double as buttons. Also, there are additional buttons to page through the parameter menus. A tap is included.
It's easy to edit presets, however, it should be easier to turn off an engine other than editing the patch. And it isn't consistent with regards to the dry/wet mix throughout the algorithms. For the reverb, there is no "mix" control, rather a combination of "dry" signal and "fx lvl" adjustments are needed when I would prefer a simple mix control like the other algorithms have.
When experimenting with thick sounds, it can be easy to overload things and have clipping occur, but it's easy to adjust the gain levels to fix the problem when it happens.
There are 10 routing options for the two engines but you can subtract 6 of those if you do not plan on using a combination of digital AND analog inputs/outputs, as most probably don't. But it is a nice feature to be able to utilize all of the inputs if you want.
I take issue with page 22 of the manual. I quote- "Thanks to its exhaustive set of digital connections, the REV2496 is almost predestined for use in a complete digital setup." A little unfounded arrogance as I am currently in the process of ordering a converter so I can connect the V-Verb's optical to my mixer's coaxial. The REV2496 has optical and AES/EBU only.
24 bit 96k, and uses 32 bit internal processing.
Sound Quality: 10
The reverb is excellent. Sounds great!! Completely smooth tails. I previously owned an MPX-1 and the reverb on this blows it away. Every one of the reverb algorithims are fantastic. I am truly amazed this thing only cost $250 and with 24/96!
Delay: Only one second of delay time. You can have up to three delays at once. Delays sound very good.
Chorus/Flanger: Not bad, nothing to write home about. I've heard worse.
Phaser: Same.
Tremolo: Fine tremolo effect.
Compressor: Haven't tried it yet...
Reliability: N/A
The knobs don't seem like the sturdiest knobs in the world, but for its low price I can't complain.
Customer Support: N/A
No clue.
Overall Rating: 10
Best reverb for the price I am guessing and with 24/96, it's an especially great deal.
Raoul
194
Posteur·euse AFfiné·e
Membre depuis 22 ans
47 Posté le 06/08/2004 à 09:35:40
Je viens de passer cde chez Thomman, je reviens vers vous pour faire un retour.
Anonyme
1531
48 Posté le 13/08/2004 à 02:48:59
C'est cool, tiens nous au courant quand tu pourras tester la bête 
!
!Raoul
194
Posteur·euse AFfiné·e
Membre depuis 22 ans
49 Posté le 13/08/2004 à 11:50:02
Il va falloir attendre, ils se sont gourés sur le ZIP code.
Raoul
194
Posteur·euse AFfiné·e
Membre depuis 22 ans
50 Posté le 18/08/2004 à 10:25:58
Une autre revue prise ds un forum SOS en attendant la mienne.
Two weeks ago I ordered a V-verb at my local music-dealer here in Basel.Since I couldn't find any recommendation yet (reviews,tests..)I just speculated that the investment of 500 CHF would be worthwhile if just half of the Behringer claims ("high end"....) would be true.I already use a TC-Electronics M-3000 and M-2000 along with the internal effects of my 02R96 console and was never 100% satisfied with the reverbs offered by the TC machines.Especially for vocals with a long reveb-tail the "realistic"sounding approach doesn't always create the best results if you are looking for something "warm".The V-verb was connected with an the AES-EBU cable to the mixer,configuration as two independant effect-processors (two mono aux-busses routed into and a stereo mix return coming from the V-verb) was easy and the little graphic symbols reminded me of the TC-Electronics routing symbols....
The reverbs are simply stunning,not only for project or homerecording standards,but also for professional ones.Behringer claims to have modelled some really expensive machines such as the TC-M 4000 and Lexicon 960 reverb;and the "960 ambience" and "960 church" are indeed impressive.You will find a Roland Dimension D simulation named "Dimension B" and it's just as impressive as the original.The long reverb programs that are based on a Lexicon 960 algorithm have the "magic" Lexicon quality of never "smearing" a mix even when used generously.
There is no question that a TC-3000 or TC-2000 are worth their money,since reverb-quality is always a question of taste and they excel in their field of "transparent" and "realistic" reverbs.(Especially for the "smaller" room simulations)What Behringer offers with the V-verb is simply as high-class quality,just for much less money.This is an awesome machine for an incredible price that makes REAL top notch reverb available for almost everyone.
Broken
Active Member
From: Sydney Australia
Registered: March 26, 2002
Posts: 115
posted August 02, 2004 12:17 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Can you put up some audio demos?
WT
Active Member
Registered: June 07, 2001
Posts: 258
posted August 03, 2004 11:33 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
humm... this review had me very interested till I noticed the number of posts by this fellow.
An astroturfing attempt, perhaps? Call me paranoid...
In any case, SOS did give the unit a favorable (though not quite AS glowing) review in the latest issue! I reckon anything that gives the big expensive units a run for the money is a good thing.
Templar
Virgin Member
From: Basel
Registered: July 08, 2004
Posts: 3
posted August 09, 2004 01:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "fellow" who wrote this is a professional countertenor,traveling arround the world singing concerts and opera-performances.
I just discovered the forum at SOS,but i am a subscriber for more than 5 years now.I bought my first Synthesizer in 1985 (Casio CZ-1000) and have worked for seven years,during my studies,at the "studio for electronic music" of the music-academy in Basel.My first sequencer was a sequential circuits module for the Commodore C-64.Since then I have constantly upgraded my own private studio here in Switzerland.I am definetely not the biggest Behringer fan,since I sold most of my Behringer stuff in the past years when I upgraded to higher quality processors.I was surprised,that the review in SOS was rather cool,giving the usual "performance of other reverbs costing much more".Fact is,that you would have to pay arround four times as much to get the SPX-2000,which is the next cheapest reverb with full 24bit 96khz connections.Behringer never got rid of the "cheap" image.Their "vintager" series of Tube-processors didn't find buyers for the initial asking-price.The pro-studios prefered their focusrite,DBX,Manley....machines.
To say "I don't feel the reverbs have the same deph or compexity as those of a Lexicon PCM-91,and the ambience algorithms aren't nearly as authentic sounding to my ears" without any direct comparison (A-B listening) is not fair.I had the PCM-91 in my studio for a week and returned it,because it doesn't have true dual-processing.(just some fixed combination-presets,that don't give the same routing flexibilty as TC's reverbs or the V-verb)
I would never go that far to say that after listening to a PCM-91 a while ago I'd be able to judge (from my memory) if it's "denser" or "more complex" than the V-verb.Of course that is what we all want to believe,since everybody who pays 1500€ for a PCM-91 wouldn't like the thought that another reverb costing 300€ plays soundwise within the same league.I can imagine that Lexicon is not too happy about Behringers "convolution theft",that emulates the Lexicon algorithms within the V-verb.On the other hand we have to realise,that the "edge" in algorthim programming,that justified lexicons "premium" prices isn't that sharp anymore.Other companies made their homework and already the TC-M 3000 had an excellent review in SOS:"but when it comes to purely reverb, most listeners would agree that Lexicon have always been a cut above the opposition. The new TC unit is certainly of that same calibre and, I believe, even has the edge."
Seems that with the price tag of the TC- M 3000 the reviewer could dare to make such a statement.Maybe that's the V-verb's curse....
Two weeks ago I ordered a V-verb at my local music-dealer here in Basel.Since I couldn't find any recommendation yet (reviews,tests..)I just speculated that the investment of 500 CHF would be worthwhile if just half of the Behringer claims ("high end"....) would be true.I already use a TC-Electronics M-3000 and M-2000 along with the internal effects of my 02R96 console and was never 100% satisfied with the reverbs offered by the TC machines.Especially for vocals with a long reveb-tail the "realistic"sounding approach doesn't always create the best results if you are looking for something "warm".The V-verb was connected with an the AES-EBU cable to the mixer,configuration as two independant effect-processors (two mono aux-busses routed into and a stereo mix return coming from the V-verb) was easy and the little graphic symbols reminded me of the TC-Electronics routing symbols....
The reverbs are simply stunning,not only for project or homerecording standards,but also for professional ones.Behringer claims to have modelled some really expensive machines such as the TC-M 4000 and Lexicon 960 reverb;and the "960 ambience" and "960 church" are indeed impressive.You will find a Roland Dimension D simulation named "Dimension B" and it's just as impressive as the original.The long reverb programs that are based on a Lexicon 960 algorithm have the "magic" Lexicon quality of never "smearing" a mix even when used generously.
There is no question that a TC-3000 or TC-2000 are worth their money,since reverb-quality is always a question of taste and they excel in their field of "transparent" and "realistic" reverbs.(Especially for the "smaller" room simulations)What Behringer offers with the V-verb is simply as high-class quality,just for much less money.This is an awesome machine for an incredible price that makes REAL top notch reverb available for almost everyone.
Broken
Active Member
From: Sydney Australia
Registered: March 26, 2002
Posts: 115
posted August 02, 2004 12:17 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Can you put up some audio demos?
WT
Active Member
Registered: June 07, 2001
Posts: 258
posted August 03, 2004 11:33 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
humm... this review had me very interested till I noticed the number of posts by this fellow.
An astroturfing attempt, perhaps? Call me paranoid...
In any case, SOS did give the unit a favorable (though not quite AS glowing) review in the latest issue! I reckon anything that gives the big expensive units a run for the money is a good thing.
Templar
Virgin Member
From: Basel
Registered: July 08, 2004
Posts: 3
posted August 09, 2004 01:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "fellow" who wrote this is a professional countertenor,traveling arround the world singing concerts and opera-performances.
I just discovered the forum at SOS,but i am a subscriber for more than 5 years now.I bought my first Synthesizer in 1985 (Casio CZ-1000) and have worked for seven years,during my studies,at the "studio for electronic music" of the music-academy in Basel.My first sequencer was a sequential circuits module for the Commodore C-64.Since then I have constantly upgraded my own private studio here in Switzerland.I am definetely not the biggest Behringer fan,since I sold most of my Behringer stuff in the past years when I upgraded to higher quality processors.I was surprised,that the review in SOS was rather cool,giving the usual "performance of other reverbs costing much more".Fact is,that you would have to pay arround four times as much to get the SPX-2000,which is the next cheapest reverb with full 24bit 96khz connections.Behringer never got rid of the "cheap" image.Their "vintager" series of Tube-processors didn't find buyers for the initial asking-price.The pro-studios prefered their focusrite,DBX,Manley....machines.
To say "I don't feel the reverbs have the same deph or compexity as those of a Lexicon PCM-91,and the ambience algorithms aren't nearly as authentic sounding to my ears" without any direct comparison (A-B listening) is not fair.I had the PCM-91 in my studio for a week and returned it,because it doesn't have true dual-processing.(just some fixed combination-presets,that don't give the same routing flexibilty as TC's reverbs or the V-verb)
I would never go that far to say that after listening to a PCM-91 a while ago I'd be able to judge (from my memory) if it's "denser" or "more complex" than the V-verb.Of course that is what we all want to believe,since everybody who pays 1500€ for a PCM-91 wouldn't like the thought that another reverb costing 300€ plays soundwise within the same league.I can imagine that Lexicon is not too happy about Behringers "convolution theft",that emulates the Lexicon algorithms within the V-verb.On the other hand we have to realise,that the "edge" in algorthim programming,that justified lexicons "premium" prices isn't that sharp anymore.Other companies made their homework and already the TC-M 3000 had an excellent review in SOS:"but when it comes to purely reverb, most listeners would agree that Lexicon have always been a cut above the opposition. The new TC unit is certainly of that same calibre and, I believe, even has the edge."
Seems that with the price tag of the TC- M 3000 the reviewer could dare to make such a statement.Maybe that's the V-verb's curse....
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